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Friday, January 06, 2006


Super 14: South Africa - Super 14 under the spotlight: The Cheetahs

In what might be a surprise to some, my third team I am taking a closer look at are the Vodacom Cheetahs, and not as most would expect, the Stormers. Many of you know my provincial affiliation, and believe me nothing pains me more than accepting the fact that this might be the worst season yet for my beloved team.

But this article is not about the Stormers, it is about the team and coach who surprised friend and foe in 2005, the Vodacom Cheetahs. But, it is also not the Currie Cup anymore, it is arguably the toughest international club/union competition, the Super 14.

The Cheetahs probably had, and still will have, the most difficult road ahead of them out of all the South African Super 14 teams. Plagued by bad press, SARU and government mud-slinging and various other problems when the 5th South African Super 14 franchise was awarded, Rassie and his merry men had it everything but easy in the build up to probably their most important competition season in the union’s history.

The best thing that could have happened to the Cheetah franchise and specifically Rassie Erasmus was when the biggest provincial arm of the franchise, the Cheetahs, won the Currie Cup in 2005. Not only did they silence a lot of doomsayers, but they beat the best provincial team in South Africa on their home ground. What makes it even more amazing is if you take into account that the Bulls team that competed in the Currie Cup final, was almost the exact same team, which did South Africa proud in the Super 12 competition in 2005.

The reason for that upset was debated in length, and everyone has their views on why the Bulls lost that game, but to me it proved one very important thing, the Cheetahs, can take on any team on any day and in any circumstance, and beat them.

Although I seldom single out one individual when it comes to success in the game of rugby, it is extremely difficult not to attribute the success of this team to one man’s genius, Rassie Erasmus.

There are many reasons why Rassie has been so successful, but none more so for his ability and fondness for an aspect of the game I put a lot of stock in too, technical analysis.

Mr. Erasmus has been hailed by almost every rugby personality in South Africa, including the media, coaches, players, etc., as just about everything, from being a student of the game since his playing days, to the best technical brain in the business. And he deserves every single compliment. Because what he has achieved in such a short space and time is nothing short of amazing. But as I hinted in the Bulls article, he could never have done this on his own.

It is actually amazing to think that the two franchises’ structures are almost exactly the same. As highlighted in my Bulls piece, it is my belief that they were such a successful outfit in 2005 because of three main factors, and those three factors working together side by side and complimenting each other, the coach, the boss, and the captain. The only real difference being that Rassie was able to achieve his goal as coach much quicker than Heyneke did, but there are reasons for that too.

It is well documented and well known that Harold Verster is a staunch supporter of Rassie and his vision. Hell he had to be to keep on supporting him after receiving all the hate mail from Cheetah fans during the Currie Cup campaign – and by the way I did apologise and promised never to send mail like that again.

What is even more amazing is that I believe Rassie finds himself in almost exactly the same position Heyneke does with the Bulls, they both lost their respective captains who played a massive part in their teams’ success.

This, and one other factor, will be Rassie’s biggest challenge to overcome. But as our respected Cheetah supporter, Oranje Orakel, basically confirmed this morning what I have heard flying around rugby circles and the media recently, Rassie, unlike Heyneke, has the perfect replacement for Naka Drotske, Juan Smith.

Juan Smith is regarded by many of his peers to be, not only one of the best in his position, but also one of the few rugby players around that uses the muscle that matters the most more often than not.

This puts him in the same class as a Springbok that played not to long ago, and is now his coach at the Cheetahs.

So although I do believe the loss of Naka to be significant, I do not believe the impact on the team will be as huge as it will be for the Bulls. In Juan, Rassie not only has a brilliant player that will no doubt buy into his vision for the Super 14, but surprisingly, also a player that is well respected not only by his Cheetah team mates, but from players around the world. I say surprisingly because that is some achievement for a guy as young as him.

Unfortunately for Cheetah fans, there is an even bigger problem or obstacle Rassie is faced with, and one that might sink them completely.

I am a very passionate rugby supporter, and emotion to me, plays a big part in the game. I am also one of those rugby romantics that would love to believe that guts, passion and pride will overcome everything in the game I love, but in reality, in today’s day and age and the way the game has evolved, one thing is very important for any team to succeed on the international circuit, experience.

Unfortunately I had to wake up to the fact that guts, passion and pride will only get you so far in international rugby. A huge percentage of Cheetah players will find themselves in situations they have never quite experienced before in their lives, and I think that will play a major role.

This concern is highlighted by stories that came out after the Currie Cup victory last year, where some senior statesman in the Cheetah squad came out and said that although it was a nerve racking experience, it was a hell of a lot better than the previous year when they also met the Blue Bulls in the final, because they had been there before, and knew what to expect.

It is true that in the forwards the Cheetahs have a couple of old heads that has been there before, and even has national experience, but my concern is not so much with the forwards, it is more the backs.

Like the Lions, the Cheetahs has a good enough pack to mix it up with the best of them, but unfortunately for them, they don’t even come close to the Jo’burg boys when it comes to firepower in the back division.

Unlike many people out there, I do not rate Willem de Waal at all. I think he is an extremely ordinary flyhalf that offers very little to a team. I thought about pulling a Jake White on myself and go as far as saying he wont make an Argentinean 7th …………. Okay I wont be as harsh, but the fact is, to me he is the type of player that, yes you know what you have in him, but he is the type of player does the basics of flyhalf play reasonably well, but gives you nothing more to give your team even the slightest edge over your opposing team. In my view, he is a good Currie Cup player and nothing more.

I do not want to go into my suggestions on who should play where in the Cheetah backline, because I find it very unlikely that Rassie will mess around with the number 10 position, so expect Willem to be his first choice. With that view I will discuss the players around him.

In a move that I think will please our resident Cheetah supporter to some extent, I believe Rassie might be tempted in playing Meyer Bosman at inside center, I certainly would. My views on the roles of 10, 12 and 13, have been mentioned many times before, and it is with this view that I believe Meyer can develop into a world class inside center.

Meyer has all the attributes I believe you need to be a world class inside center. He has speed, vision, good distribution skills to both his left and right, and he is a big boy that should in time effectively break the defensive lines and put guys next to him in space. To add to that, he has a killer boot. The only question in my view hangs around his defensive capabilities but that is only because I have seen so little of him.

Ignoring the De Waal issue, the one area the Cheetah boys are very thin on experience are in the mid-field, partnering Meyer and overseas import Keith Lowen will be a masterstroke in my view.

With your wings being adequate but nothing spectacular, and a real talent in the making at 15 in Bevin Fortuin, picking the right center combination will be Rassie’s most important decision to make.

Gaffie, whom I would have loved to see in the number 10 jumper, can provide more than decent cover on the wing and I hope beyond all hope that Rassie does not relegate Fortuin to the bench. Gaffie’s experience combined with his prodigious boot and cover he can provide in defensive situations could help Fortuin develop into a very good fullback.

As with Ludeke and the Cats forwards, a lot will depend on who Rassie selects in certain positions in the backline. My ideal backline if I was coach will include:

9. Oelschig
10. Du Toit
11. Passens
12. Bosman
13. Lowen
14. Fredericks
15. Fortuin

It will be interesting to see what Rassie does though, but being the creative genius he is, I am sure we will see a couple of surprises.

Players to watch

I first saw this guy in 2005, and he impressed me a hell of a lot. He seems to have great anticipation and he looks to love to score tries. I am a bit concerned yet again on his defensive capabilities but this also, has a lot to do with the fact that I have seen very little of him so far. But there is no doubt in my mind Bevan Fortuin could become one of the finds for 2006. Remember this name, I think we are going to hear a lot more of him.

The experience Gaffie du Toit will bring to an otherwise green backline will be invaluable. I was one to always rate this guy, and much like Andre Pretorius, Gaffie is very much a confidence player. Moving to the Cheetahs could be his best move yet as I believe he will absolutely flourish in the environment Rassie has created for his players. The only question remains is where he will be used? I really hope Rassie does not become all conservative on this selection.

Not knowing, or actually believing that Bosman will mostly come off the bench, the role Keith Lowen has to fulfill is going to be huge. He should add quite a bit of much needed international experience and prove quite valuable to the team on tour as well.

There is nothing I would enjoy more in 2006 than to eat my words on players I criticize or believe to be not good enough to play for a 7th team Japanese ………….. – sorry, there I go again. For the good of South African Super 14 aspirations but even more for his own team, I hope Willem de Waal will prove to be one of those players, but I do not see it happening. As with any team, your flyhalf are one of the most important players in a team, and for the Cheetahs to finish anywhere close to respectable, he will need to come to the party.

In Ryno van der Merwe, Juan Smith, Henro Scholtz and Kabamba Floors, Rassie is certainly not short on talent in the loose forward department. Two players specifically will need to perform huge roles though, Ryno and Juan. Ryno’s speed to the breakdown is going to be crucial to slow down opposition’s ball to give his backline half a chance of competing against the NZ and Australian flyers. Juan will also have to do a lot more than just deliver the outstanding performances we have become used to, he, much like Wikus van Heerden of the Cats, will need to lead a relatively young and inexperienced team to greatness, or in a more realistic description, Super 14 survival.

It could also be a great opportunity for Juan to stake a claim in the Springbok setup as John Smit’s understudy. But if there is one guy I have absolutely no doubt in delivering, it is Juan Smit.

Maybe not as much through their individual performances but more through other aspects of their game they will need to bring to the team, Os Du Randt and Ollie le Roux’s influence and impact needed for this team to be successful is going to be absolutely invaluable. As mentioned before, my biggest fear for Rassie’s men, is the amount of experience his team has. I just get the feeling that if they are 15 nil down after half time in a place like Carrisbrooke, you will need to likes of these two to really step up and take charge if Rassie’s men are to stand any chance.

Logical Prediction

Before the Currie Cup final last year, not many people, including myself, gave Rassie’s men much of a chance of surviving, let alone setting the world alight in the Super 14. Strange how quickly perceptions can change.

I believe realistically their fans should not expect anything more than a mid-table finish. Rassie and his merry men will surely aim for a semifinal spot, and why not, it is not impossible, but in my view, highly unlikely.

I think they will also be measured, unfairly in my view, against the other new franchise, the Western Force. It will be quite an achievement if the Cheetahs do end up higher on the log than John Mitchell’s men, and that is something I hope they achieve, and if they do, no matter where they find themselves on the log, they can look back at a successful campaign. The reason for my view is simply because of the path both teams and coaches had to walk leading up to the competition, how everybody expects (and in some cases pray) the Cheetahs will get snotted this year, and that Rassie would prove to be an even better coach than the man I personally regard as the best in the business at the moment.

Their opening match against the Bulls in Bloemfontein is going to be a cracker, and will be vitally important for Rassie and the team, because it will set the tone for the rest of the competition for the Cheetahs. If they loose, it will have a huge impact on the team, but if they win, not only would they have beaten the best team in South Africa twice in the space of a couple of months, but it would also give the young players a huge boost which they can take into the rest of the competition. But looking at the Super 12 in 2005 and the match at Ellispark, one thing is for damn sure, Rassie has done it before, so there is no reason to believe he won’t do it again.

Lowest possible log position: 12
Highest possible log position: 7

Note: I do believe that if the Cheetahs loose one or two crucial games, like the opening match against the Bulls, everything could fall apart very quickly for the boys in white, hence the very low prediction if they fail. Again I would attribute the reason for my prediction to a lack of experience that will be needed for a team to bounce back, and something I believe the Cheetahs lack.

Personal Prediction

If there ever were two teams who I find very difficult to predict what type of season they will have, it is the Cheetahs and the Stormers. There are just so many variables that could come into play during the course of the season, and the teams’ unpredictability does not quite help either.

Personally I do believe the Cheetahs will do better than the Stormers, yet again for one reason and one reason only, Mr. Erasmus. Where the Cheetahs seem to have a very happy camp and like the Bulls, a family setup, the Stormers seem to be in disarray. It is a very close call though between these two and to stick my neck out on this one might be premature, because the Stormers do have one thing that counts in their favour, they, apart from last year, have consistently performed well in this competition whereas the Cheetahs are the new kids on the block. But, as I mentioned in my Bulls piece, I do put a lot of stock into structures, and this is something the Cheetahs have, and the Stormers, in my view, don’t.

Given Rassie displays the same courage in selections and game plans he did in the Currie Cup, the Cheetahs might just be one of the major shocks of the season.

Lowest possible log position: 10
Highest possible log position: 5
Well as the resident Cheetah RugRat i will thank Koring Rosenmier for a very interesting piece on the Cheetahs.

I believe it is a bit harsh on Willem De Waal- but then let us see how the season goes.

I also believe that Gaffie will be a huge positive surprise for a lot of debunkers- on the rest total agreement.

So who is coming for the first game?
thanks OO,

but i do believe Willem is at best a reasonable CC player. i cant help but get the feeling though rassie has a few surprises up his sleeve... will wait and see.

oh yeah, and apologise to cheetah supporters but the new logo is no-where to be found, so i used you new jersey.

I will rest on De Waal.

I also would like to see Bosman playing alot in 12. Will force him to become mature. gaffie might just be an awesome 10 in that side.

Would like to see all the play against the Spears- is there any news whether that game will be televised?

on the logo

I am still struggling to get hold of Chillies- who is designing the new Vodacom Cheetahs site as there is no downloadable image

The current ones is already in Flash.

Do you have a Vodacom S14 image?
I would also like to see if Lowen has the speed for 13. It might be that Goodes will start at 12- interchange with Bosman- Hollenbach Cooke to contest 13.

It will be a decent fight between Zweni & Passens.

man I hope Barend Pietersen roer all the lock in the S14 Big Vic included.
Willem De Waal failed against top opposdition with the Cats last year.

I believe he is a solid flyhalf, but you need to be a special 10 to stand out in S14 and I personally think that the scrum/flyhalf pairing is where the CU will come short this year. Isn't Micheal Claasens available for selection or do you rate Falie as better PA?

Also, Ryno VDM is going to find himself up against teams that hold the philosophy that they need speeding fetchers to compete at the breakdown in every match (unlike us in SA who don't see the need for specialist fetchers for some reason).

Against the Lions, facing fast speeders in Gerhard Vosloo and Baywatch Grobbelaar last year he was overshadowed on both occasions.

I think that Henro and Juan will deliver but I doubt that Ryno will be able to deliver the intense abilities he displayed against the huge but slow-coach Bulls last year.

The most will depend on Rassie's reading of the other teams.
the experience lowen will bring to the midfield will be huge, especially in tight games, also looking the respective weights of bosman and lowen, that would be one mean midfield. the other guys seem a bit lightweight imo. you got some decent wings, more than i can say for the cats. but you midfield is your weak area imo.

gaffie would be awesome as the first choice 10, as to whether is it will be televised, i wont bet on it.
Great arti PA,

Damn setting a high standard for the future.
i do rate him better davids, he has a bit of ricky january in him and the boy has balls gallore.

i agree on ryno to some extent, but i think he will be effective this year.

it will be interesting to see if juan can handle the pressures that comes with captaincy.

did you read my views on your cats team btw davids?
Ja I did thanks PA.

Good article.
The debate you and cab had was similarly very informative, but I had no time to comment as I was under a massive deadline. I still am, but I've extended it so I can go home and work on the weekend.  
Good article Pissant. But me thinks that come the first game, the Cheetahs fairy taly is gonna come to an abrupt end.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist getting one in early against OO. I suspect things might heat up in the week heading into that game.

Anyway, interesting thought on Ryno vd Merwe. I think he's quite good and I'm a huge fan of Hendro Scholts. They have quite a good loos trio. Good Luck to them and may they be successfull (except for the first game though!)
Is it my imagination but Kandas-er soryy knadas is very silent on Spear news lately?  
Hehehe Aldo

Sien ons jou vir daardie fairy tale ending game- of gaan jy op die plass wegkruip ;-)

Jy weet mos Murph het 'n bus wat kom.... vol Cheetah manne
I sincerely believe that Bulls are going to come out smoking in that first game and CU will pay big time for the CC Final embarrassment.

I think it still hurts Heynecke that Rassie completely outfoxed and out thought him in that match and effectively snatched victory from the gaping jaws of defeat.

Heynecke is an f---ing good coach and I personally think he'll be itching for a chance at Rassie's boys again. There'll also be a healthy dose of respect in the Bulls camp. They completely underestimated FS in 2005 and paid big time. This year's S14 opener is going to be a shocker.

In the past the local derbies have been hard fought jangling affairs. As though our players take out their best to display against each other. With so much at stake this year, it'll get even worse and all the home derbies are going to be hardcore bruising affairs.


In the past, the teams in SA who started off at home and then went on tour later tended to do better than those who went on tour and then came home to play their last matches at home.

I see that the team itenerary is not something you've taken consideration of in guessing team performances. Why not?
hehe aldo,

i think a fairy tale will end come feb, but it wont be the cheetahs'.

Ja en met Murph daar gaan die hele plek op horings geneem word.

Hoop julle mense in Bloem is reg daarvoor!!!


Kandas is baie stil op die oomblik.
Het jy Murph se kontak details? Sal dit oorweeg, dit sal nogal lekker wees om met my bloubul trui te sit tussen al daardie cheetah manne na ons julle gesnot het!

Grap net, op die oomblik weet ek nie eers of ek die game gaan kan kyk nie. Ek gaan moontlik in die kaap wees, ons moet al York international se servers in SA upgrade en hulle hele netwerk oordoen, ons het tyd van die Vrydag middag twaalfuur tot die Maandag oggend ses uur. Kaapstad gaan my verantwoordelikheid wees, so ek gaan tien teen een die hele naweek werk. Ek hoop nie so nie.

And it's with good reason that your striped emotion tinged glasses would want the Bulls to meet a sticky end in Bloem....

Good point DavidS- the role that travelling will play.

I buy your point on RVDM going to struggle against the "faster" Lions

Will it make a diff to rest him and play Floors? or to rest Scholtz and play Floors & Ryno? What about something wild like playing Anton Pitout at 6 against the Cats ? ;-)
Watse servers sit julle in?  

i was wondering when someone will ask me that, and apart from the cheetahs doing this for the first time, and the bulls, who seem to be unstoppable at loftus, i think the traveling factor is highly overrated.

after i look at all the SA teams i was will do a piece on the super 14 as a whole and give my views on teams to watch out for and teams that i believe will be scraping the barrel.

we have to remember that all NZ and Aussie teams are also entering foreign territory here where they will too spend more time on the road because of the extra teams. i think it will have a bigger impact on them than it will on us as our guys, apart from the cheetahs, are more or less used to it.

in fact, i believe that for once we have almost an equal playing field when it comes to home ground advantage in this comp.

i also believe that an australian team, and not south african, will carry the wooden spoon this year, and the crusaders wont win the comp. but that is almost giving too much away already.

look home ground advantage does count for a lot, but apart from the bulls, i think out other teams - well maybe not the sharks, travel quite well.

Bloem is a Murph friendly Zone he is well known here Him and his gnome.

Aldo meer belangrik , wat gebeur met die servers wat uitgehaal word ;-)
Ag moet nou nie lelik wees nie pissant, jou span se airytale moet nog begin, once again, just kidding, I know WP has a rich rugby history.  
the bulls and stormers do have a better draw, and that is about the only reason i believe the stormers wont get relegated.

also, given the intensity pf the comp this year as you mentioned, i think we will see a completely different approach from all SA teams than what we have become accustomed to.
Goeie vraag OO, ek weet nie, sal hulle maar seker op die vliegtuig pak en saambring plaas toe. Ons moet hulle oues upgrade, gaan jou nou nie al die specs gee nie, maar hulle hardloop op die oomblik nog op server 2000 en gaan na 2003 SP1 toe. Ek is bly ek hoef nie J'burg te doen nie, my baas en so paar ouens doen hom, die J'burg tak het so 200 rekenaars en al die rekenaars word ge upgrade na XP toe, so die manne gaan werk, ek hoef gelukkig net die servers te doen.  

ek verwag lelike dinge van kaapstad af so ek bring nie eens my span in die argument in nie!!!!
Jeez as daar dalk 'n blase of wat rondle- drop hom sommer hier oor Bloem- kan wondere met Ubuntu verrig ;-)  
Jeez as daar dalk 'n blase of wat rondle- drop hom sommer hier oor Bloem- kan wondere met Ubuntu verrig ;-)  
blase = Blade  

In the past the SA teams have played their best rugby against each other.

Last year's Bulls demolition of the Crusaders and the year before's Cats game against the Brumbies are exceptions that prove the rule.

For some reason our players seem to raise the intensity against each other rather than against the foreign teams.

I reckon you're right about the Aussie team. The Reds haven't even named a coach for the comp yet!!!!!

I reckon they're the best bet to wooden spoon this year and by a wide margin.

I also reckon that touring to SA will not be as easy as it appeared to be in the past for foreign teams and don't be amazed to see foreign teams leave our shores with no wins whatsoever and being thankful for bonus points.

With their history, I reckon the Crusaders are still the mustard. They base their play on traditional strengths and that's their strength. It'll be the same this year I reckon.

Shouldn't we ask Patrick to do us a similar set of pieces on the five Kiwi teams?
OO, ek weet dood eerlik nie wat ons met die oues doen nie, sal tien teen een nie eers die Kaapstad tak verlaat nie.

So jy is 'm linux outjie? Ek was, totdat ek begin werk het waar ek nou is, nou werk ek vir 'n Microsoft Partner en laat ek dit so stel, Microsoft is net soveel eenvoudiger as linux. Ook net so stabiel, anders as wat ek altyd geglo het. Ek het altyd gedink dat die wereld 'n beter plek sal wees as Bill gates dood neerval, nou nie meer nie. Ek dink nog steeds hulle snaai 'n mens met die prys van hulle sagteware, maar nou ja, jy betaal vir kwaliteit. Al wat Linux beter is voor, is vir 'n goeie firewall.
Rassie knows his backline is a weakness, hence he has recruited some experienced backs to bring his youngsters on.

He has a good set of forwards.

His side has no consistancy though.
They played well against the Cats and Stormers only to lose all 4, if I remember correctly.

It could be debated that the Cheetahs shouldn't have come anywhere near a semi-final.

Kind of like the situation in the English football 1st division where a side finishes 6th on the log but still get's a shot at promotion via the playoffs.Why not just promote the side that comes 3rd?

Inconsistancy.....the Cheetahs achilles heel.

Also, as a coach that appears to be a "reactive tactician", the S14 has far less time for a coach to study his opposition and implement a plan.Not quite like playing the Bulls or Stormers where he knows exactly what is needed to win.

Rassie needs to come up with his own pattern and gameplan.
Davids, I think we should get Tackler to do a piece for us. Then we can get the old classics, like "the team that snotted the Bulls 23-0 last year", and "who could ever forget that record snotting the Boks got at the hands of a AB team containg a lot of Blues players?"  

Ek glo nog altyd aan 'n hybrid

Ek is nie bereid om MS se lisensies vir die huis omgewing te koop nie- Ek hou van Ubuntu by die huis

Werk met Bill se goete by die werk- as ek die geld gehad het was daar net Apple in my huis

the crusaders will definately be in the top 4 no doubt, but as a change in scenary is seemingly brewing in SA, i think the same is happening in NZ.

Your idea on Patrick is brilliant, it will be nice to see how they rate their own teams and their chances.


very good points, consistancy will be key to rassie and his boys. but the fact that they might not know much about the opposition might work in their favour, where it seems that most SA teams are in awe of certain teams, even when they are not as good as everyone thinks, the cheetahs ignorance might prove to be handy.

agree 100% on the game plan point you make, like i mentioned, if rassie is going to be conservative regarding selections and styles of play, they will see their asses.
Sal nou nie hardop se nie, maar hoekom vir lisensies by die huis betaal. Microsoft gaan mos nie agter een ou aangaan nie. Solank jy nie die goed verkoop nie is die saak reg.  
Don't underestimate Bloem though.

If the Wobblies are scared of going to Jo'burg.....they'll be shit scared of going into the South African outback.
damn right you are StP, and we should give them a proper 'boere' welcome as well.  
St Pete

Bloem part of the South african outback- you have gone bonkers in the snow mate.

I concede it is not the end all & bee all of ZA nightlife & jetcruzin but outback....nah
Ok Oranje,
I concede.

Dit is a bloody lekker plek to jol.
Those overseas teams have traditionally beaten the Cats at Bloem.

The Freestate is half the Cats.

Just a thought.

A horrible one but just a thought.


Good points. Freestate were actually pretty lucky to get to the finals last year given their inconsistency during the season. I mean, if it were not for the stupid Section X and Y system, the Sharks would have gone through to the Premiership semi because they had more points on the log than FS!
In the latest FHM Bloem was rated as the second coolest place in SA to jol.

Stellies won it, but Bloem won in the sections of best nightclub and hottest dollies.
He ho

Thanks St Pete

man maybe I should get me a FHM

DavidS are you sure about your maths

Geez we are talking S14 2006 here CC 2005 is old hat- Cheetahs won it

So basically my list reads as follows.

Places Jolled already:

Beanos Aires
New Orleans

Places still to jol:

Bloemfontein are bloody kidding right?
Ag St peet

Go roll a pastrie

Bloem is cool enough for us.

Most of the girls you found in these exotic places are anyway eva from Trodsjanspor- dolled up to hid the misuse since 10- so who are you kidding? -no pun intended

PS now davidS will sommer call me bedonnerd again

I am sure of my math, and yes I concede that FS won the thing. The point I'm trying to make is that they should by all rights, never even have seen a semi because they were inconsistent.


None of the places you mention are in SA are they?

Or did you misread what I posted. Maybe with your worldly wise ways you can enlighten us to the best places to jol with the best drinks, friendliest bouncers and hottest dollies and easiest laid dollies seeing as we are such an inward looking, navel contemplating bunch of hillbillies...

StP is getting up my nose again being a funny little snowy bunny
Hold on,
I can also be a inward looking,navel contemplating hill billy when needed.

I just choose to be an abtuse dickhead most of the time.

All I said was that Bloem must be a nasty place to visit for the Sydney socialites.

Am I right or wrong?
Ok conceded -they may not like it here but it is way better than Coober Pedy  
Dunno StP

Never met a Sydney socialite.

What do you reckon?

BTW it's Obtuse

Again it's not as though the average reader of FHMSA is a Sydney socialite is it?
but I got "dickhead" right though.

How is FHMSA any different to the Ozzie version?

Bunch of bullshit articles for blokes that can't pull on their own with loads of masturbating material.

On the issue of your maths

please visit

and then inform me that I am wrong when I say that the Cheetahs had 20 points- against the strongest sides and the Sharks had 19- against the weakests sides
heheheh StP

Nice avoidance there

I buy it for the articles about fashion and the cars......and if you believe that then you believe Bloem is a better jol than Rio at Carnival time

So tell me where are the hottest dollies and where are the easiest ones?

Agreed OO

But after the rounrobin the Sharks were ahead of you guys and the top 3 in our section had more points than Province and FS.
Actually I bought this month's one because of an article about the 50 best cricet matches ever in ODI's

The eye candy wasn't too bad though...
Apparently the Wisden boys and experts rate the 99 semi CWC between us and Aus as the best ODI of all time

I personally rate it as the worst match I ever saw.
sure davids but remember they played easy teams like the lions......

both the states and wp nailed them twice in the premiership division.
must admit am looking forward to seeing how the Cheetahs and Cats do now that they have split up.

It can only be good for our rugby to have another SA side in the S14 where more players can be exposed to the game at the top level. More players for JW to choose from.

Who knows the split could be a revelation.
Looking forward to seeing how the Cheetahs and Cats do now that they have split up.

It can only be good for our rugby to have another SA side in the S14 where more players can be exposed to the game at the top level. More players for JW to choose from.

Who knows the split could be a revelation.

The Sharks, aside from Cheetahs in the final, were the only team that beat the Bulls at Loftus last season.

And FS didn't beat the Lions once. The Bulls only managed it in the semi

Although admittedly for some reason the WP got the wood over the Lions.

You guys are getting worked up I see. I bought this month's FHM when I saw the front page, I nearly fell over in the store, that chick is hot! First time in a while though, I tend to share St Pete's sentiments on the mag.
Or you end up diluting the talent pool and exposing unprepared players to the big time cab...

Cheers guys.


I know, and actually it's a magazine for the older okes who are too skaam to buy hardcore porn!!!
and dont i love every second of it!!!!!!!!!!!

in an otherwise bleak year, that was the one highlight for me!!!!
Ja PA and in an otherwise bleak year, seeing Bryan Habana rip the Bok midfield to shreds in 2004 was a cherished highlight for me too.

We may have lost to WP and the Stromers but at least we can say we beat the Bulls (and by a BIG margein in CC) in CC and S12!!!!!!

Oh and FS didn't beat us in CC ether....


cheers for now see Monday
damn this rugby must start now, we have been far to nice to one antoher for the last couple of weeks.

here is to some banter in 2006

yip that is another way to look at it, but most of our teams are already so kak, and the S14 competition is so stacked against us with all the travelling, that i figure we should milk the competition for our own ends, i.e. exposing and developing more young players to try and compete with the depth that NZ have. A player like Bosman now has more chance to start at 10 more often.

Another thing about the new franchise is that they will be keen to prove they should be there.

Have you noticed that the mood's changed a bit as well. Suddenly we're not all lighthearted anymore, the banters allready starting. Can't wait for the rugby to start. Just hope we all stay civil.
i am sure we will aldo, although we encourage people to speak their minds and love the banter, posts with religious, racial and really obscene or disgusting vulgar language wont find its place here i am sure.

and if it does it will be dealt with
I hope so PA, as long as it sticks to rugby it should all be fine. May I still call WPW and Province token posters?  
what those token coloured thugs?

by all means, even though we support the same team....
PA, what no religious, racial or obscene posts, there goes the spice of life?

i probably will be considered too much of a stirrer for this site.

i am against all forms of censorship apart from when StM converses.
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